Can I ask...

camry · Post by **camry** » Sat Sep 16, 2006 11:37 pm

...would anyone have had a cow if the race was restarted when several cars were taken out or had damage 3 seconds into the race?

I mean, this is a GAME, without members, you have 0 league. Fucking wait 4 weeks for a race, a big wreck 3 seconds into it, and you basically say "f*** you and your time spent practicing" because a rule is more powerful then what makes sense.

I mean, it wasn't lap 2, it wasn't 2 cars, several were damaged, but your more concerned with following a rule.

I've been in races and gotten in a wreck early on with no RS and never said a word, but this one bothers me because of the numbers involved, the quickness of it and the response shown by LP.

Sometimes you need to bend the rules to do what's right. Stop pumping your chest because you run a league.

Been here 4-5 years and it was more fun in the beginning, it was more fun racing 8-10 dudes every week. Every year more rules get added and cause more shit then when there wasn't as many rules. Waiting for next year and rules added that if you hit the apron or qualify outside the top 10, you'll get a 25pt penalty.

PS - Actlab, didn't realize you were LP's pocket buddy.

Post by **lepage71** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 12:25 am

Subjective restarts will only lead to more controversy. At what point is an 'extra' restart valid? 4 cars? 5 cars? 6 cars? Maybe make it 7 cars? If the points leader crashes? If it's 7 cars...and 6 wreck...well, why not just restart since we're close. What if an admin is involved? That'll certainly stir the pot. You can see how this goes. Are the admins to pull over and count the cars wrecked? It's not a good precedent to set...in fact, probably the very worst.

However, I am thinking that this is a watershed moment for restarts...namely, their elimination for next season. We'll bring this up in polls/suggestions forum later and I definitely hope to hear your opinions on it.

The beginning-of-the-race mess has happened to everyone at some point. If you don't believe me, please revisit my race at Chicagoland in 2005 (and many other instances). I remember practicing a lot, but that was just an unfortunate situation for me.

I still haven't even seen the replay...but I am going to guess that it was simply an accident. I understand what you are saying with that huge pileup, but I am glad we stayed consistent (once again) and would do the same thing if it happened again.

Pocket buddy? I thought those were called Pokemon?

ef had better not disappoint on this one...

Post by **d3efan** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 1:18 am

see? now there could be NO restarts at all. and wouldnt that be fun? although, no restarts at all is totally acceptable in any competition. tenuous at best, the 2 restarts have righted the wrong of the botched start and those using it intentionally have been penalized. but wasnt my face red at one of the road courses a few races back when i was punted, asked for a restart, and was given the big No! damaged AND in last place, well...really fun night man. so if I, or anyone else that has been hosed by the rule sees someone else benefit by a third restart? I know it's a game, but all games have their own rules. this should only serve as a lesson-like I learned mine.

HBMan23 · Post by **HBMan23** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 1:28 am

You know, it was an accident. Honestly, I was involved in the accident and I am actually happy to see the NHRL be consistant for once. Everyone should be happy. They were consistant unlike countless other times. I think that this should be pointed out and remind the Officials that this is actually how things should go. Now you need to take this stance when applying penalties. Then officials would have a legitamite shot at defending this argument.

P.S. Sorry for the wreck guys. I pushed, got the wall, got turned around. Just a bad situation.

MinnerWinner · Post by **MinnerWinner** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 11:58 am

Im not sucking up or calling people out or calling them cry babies but come on on guys. Im not even in the league but i would be happy as hell if i were you. Its something really fun to do when your not working and really awesome to go out there and race for fun. Whatever happened to the days of just going out there and racing for the win while having fun. Now i see a lot of you guys complaining on what rules are dumb and what should be changed. Just go out there and race and have fun regardless of what you think is totally gay. Call me a newb and tell me i shouldnt be saying anything because im not in the league but whatever. Thats just my point.

MinnerWinner · Post by **MinnerWinner** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 12:00 pm

Scratch that a lot of you guys complaining part only some of you guys do.

camry · Post by **camry** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:15 pm

Your absolutely right HB and LP, it was an accident, no argument about that, I never blamed anyone, and this isn't about that. But I think I may agree with LP in saying that no RS's should occur.

If not, I think we do need to be more flexible in RS's. Especially since we don't have yellow flags. It's pretty boring driving around in 15th with no shot at gaining anything except for passing those who retire.

Post by **bover907** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:12 pm

I for one vote for NO RESTARTS AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can't tell you how many F---ing times I have gotten off to one or two clean beautiful starts, only to have a second or third restart get me wrecked. I have almost, or maybe it actually has been never taken out on the first original start of the race.

Last night was no exception.

First start beautiful. I started on the outside, and got clear. (with a three car length pad I might add) Actlabs cuts off bg to gain second from last, and we have to have a restart.

Second start started on the outside, had to race side by side for this one, the 3rd place car hits apron bumps up into the car on the outside, and people go into the wall, myself getting the worst end of the stick. Naturally I asked for a restart, amongst others.

Then on the THIRD start, the 26 car in front of me gets into the wall, I have nowhere to go, went left to avoid him as he was stopping very fast. That cuts off camry and he ends up pushing me bach into the 26, then, Kyle's car ends up with no where to go, and ends up pushin me sideways as about 15 people are scrambling into the grass. I ended up getting hit at least 8 times!

Like I said. Most of the time I've gotten wrecked at the beginning of the race it's always after a restart.

NO RESTARTS AT ALL!!!!!!

Side note: Camry, Result may have been better for you and others if I just took it in the kiester and slammed into the back of hbman as he was stopping along side the wall, and maybe you and the rest would have gotten by, but Hey, I had to try to get around it. So, sorry for that, but had there not been a restart for someone in the back who was racing too hard on lap one, it wouldn't have happened anyway.

HBMan23 · Post by **HBMan23** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 7:04 pm

but had there not been a restart for someone in the back who was racing too hard on lap one, it wouldn't have happened anyway.

You know, I for one (of many i've heard) have had it with the racers who continually cause problems, cause the restarts, and use up the mulligans we DO have. I would ask that the league seriously look at the drivers in the league and analyse them closely to see if they actually belong. Accidents are one thing but when it happens every week from a couple of guys, I think the league should look at this. Just my opinion but if there were guys who caused problems every week, they probably shouldn't race in the league atleast until they improve.

P.S. I agree, NO restarts!

Post by **d3efan** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 10:10 am

i dont believe I actually slid up and bumped the car on the outside, i was hit from behind. not saying the apron slip didnt cause the wreck though because it did, sorry to all involved. i still feel i belong though! and that is the biggest reason why and why we do, have restarts. i'd like to keep them. restarts with general guidelines maybe and penalties for abusing a restart perhaps? talk amongst yourselves!

Post by **lepage71** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 12:37 pm

We currently do penalize for unnecessary restarts (http://www.nascarheatracingleague.com/rules.html).

Rookiesrock · Post by **Rookiesrock** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 1:12 pm

Maybe at the beginning of the season each driver gets 3 restarts total for the whole year....once they are all gone you get NO MORE !!!!!

WildFire · Post by **WildFire** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 1:39 pm

Yep, they do penalise for asking for unnecssary restarts. I got penalised for that at sears point... and I agree with D3 on what he says about this subject.

camry · Post by **camry** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 3:59 pm

This has NOTHING to do with penalties, or who started it. The point is what's fair or not. Nobody should have an issue restarting when 6-8 cars get damaged/wrecked <1 lap into it.

If you really think because you got a good start one time and we restarted, that you just lost your winning move, or your happy 6 cars are out because you can win now, then your probably not going to win anyways.

Everyone should have a fair shot at racing, people practice on there free time, spend weekend nights racing here, and all you get is hammered with rules.

If people need to cheat that much, that we need rules to keep them in line, then maybe they should race elsewhere.

2Quick4u · Post by **2Quick4u** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 5:34 pm

I think the restart should have been given..There were several cars involved. It's not like we haven't had 3 plus restarts at some tracks...I'm not trying to pull anybody's chain but either we should have the same amount of restarts at every track or none at all. In real life there are no restarts. :shock:

Rookiesrock · Post by **Rookiesrock** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 6:53 pm

There already is a set number of restarts for incidents other than misaligned grid restarts. To find out more check here>>>> http://www.nascarheatracingleague.com/rules.html